Two months ago, the escalation of the coronavirus crisis forced many museums and cultural institutions to close their doors to visitors. In response, many organizations shifted their efforts to engaging visitors through digital platforms, many making impressive pivots and accelerating their digital transformations. Now, as museums prepare to reopen and plan for the near and long term future, new concerns are seizing the attention of the entire cultural industry – what will the future hold? Will there be new business and engagement models? And what does the physically-distanced museum experience look like?
Last Wednesday, more than 3,600 people joined Brendan Ciecko (CEO and Founder @ Cuseum), Franklin Sirmans (Director @ Pérez Art Museum Miami), Karen Wong (Deputy Director @ New Museum) & Lath Carlson (Executive Director @ Museum of the Future) as they evaluated the profound impacts of coronavirus and offered insights about what the future will hold for museums.
View the video recording here.
Read the full transcript below.
Brendan Ciecko:
Hello, everyone, my name is Brendan Ciecko and I'm the founder and CEO of Cuseum. First off, I want to say thank you to everyone who's joining us today, as well as say thank you to our amazing guests. I hope that you're all staying safe and healthy during these unprecedented times. And if you're joining us for the first time, welcome, and for those of you who have tuned into any of our past webinars, welcome back. It's great to see you.
Over the past eight weeks, more than 30,000 people from over 50 countries have tuned into these conversations. We've covered topics ranging from digital engagement, social media, monetizing digital engagement, educational programs and strategies for reopening. Most of us have been really heads down focused on navigating these new challenges and areas of uncertainty. At some point over the past two months, it felt like we were taking things one day at a, at a time, as it was nearly impossible to know what tomorrow or the day after might look like and how long our museums might be closed for.
But it's been truly amazing to watch the museum community and the cultural community around the globe come together to share ideas, share best practices and support each other. And now as more states and countries move forward, with motions of reopening, it seems that things are a little bit more clear and stable, but it's essential and more essential than it's ever been to always be looking forward and look as many steps ahead as you can. So for the next hour, join us as we zoom out a little, think about what the future might look like what the role of digital and virtual play, how the museum experience might change, what tools and resources and skills are- are needed to ensure the future success of museums and the cultural sector.
And also earlier this week AAM’s president and CEO Laura Lott said something in her opening remarks at the annual conference that now is the time to dismantle the old and rebuild a new. Rebuilding a better museum field. So this idea of such a major shift, a major transform, it's both inspiring on one hand, but it's honestly terrifying. And some may say this metamorphosis of museums has been a long time coming, and COVID-19 was one of the unexpected catalysts. We're all stakeholders in the future of museums. We're all here to engage in this conversation. So we hope today's conversation is insightful, it's inspiring to any of your pursuits at your home organization.
Today's topic is exploring the future of museums in the era of Coronavirus. Without further ado, please allow me to introduce our special guests.
So joining us from Miami we have Franklin Sirmans. Franklin is the director of the Perez Art Museum, also known as PAMM, Miami's flagship Art Museum. Since coming to PAMM he has overseen the acquisition of more than 1,000 works of art by donation or purchase. At PAMM, Franklin has pursued his vision of PAMM as the people's Museum, representing a Miami lens by strengthening existing affiliate groups, such as the PAMM fund for African American Art, and creating the International Women's committee and the Latin American and Latinx Art Fund.
Prior to his appointment, he was the department head and curator of contemporary art at Los Angeles County Museum of Art, LACMA, and before that, he was curator of modern and contemporary art at the Menil Collection in Houston. Thanks so much for joining us, Franklin.
And joining us from New York City, we have Karen Wong. Karen is the deputy director of the New Museum in New York City where she has helped rebuild its known reputation for entrepreneurial platforms for new art and new ideas. She co-founded the initiatives, IDEAS CITY, which explores the future of cities with the belief that art and culture are essential to our metropolis, and NEW INC, the first museum-led incubator for art technology and design. Both initiatives are models for the intersection of cultural and civic engagement. She currently sits on the boards of Rhizome, a platform for emergent artistic practices and engaging technologies. And chairs the advisory board for National Sawdust, a nonprofit music venue incubating new talent, and located in Williamsburg. Thanks so much for joining us, Karen.
And last but not least, joining us from Seattle by way of Dubai, we have Lath Carlson. Lath is the executive director of the Museum of the Future, a global destination in Dubai to explore the future of science, technology and innovation. He works closely with the Dubai Future Foundation team and partners to provide an innovative and comprehensive experience for visitors to learn about future technologies that will affect their lives over the coming years. Throughout his career, Lath has been at the forefront of technology and museum practice. He was previously founding executive director of Living Computers, Museum and Lab in Seattle, Washington, a project initiated by Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen, and before that, he was vice president of exhibits and content development at the Tech Museum of Innovation in Silicon Valley. Thanks so much for joining Lath.
Lath Carlson:
Thanks for having me.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. Cool. So let's jump right into the questions. This first one's for you, Franklin. Over the past few weeks coincidentally, we've had many members of your team share their perspectives on education, membership, community and experience from this. It became really clear that you and your museum have a strong shared vision which has allowed your staff to adapt and collaborate successfully, especially in the past weeks of navigating the pandemic. How can museums ensure that their vision of the future unlocks the best their teams have to offer?
Franklin Sirmans:
Hey, Brendan, thank you, I just want to say I've had the opportunity to work with you. You mentioned members of our team, Marie Vickles is on for education and Megan McCauley for membership. And I think that one of the ways that we move forward and- and certainly, we will look very different when we reopen, we already look different as institutions today. And in order for us to learn from this challenge and this crisis we will, I believe be a lot better on the other side. And one of the ways that we get there is by relying on community and it starts first with our staff.
So I mentioned Marie, I mentioned Megan, but I have to say this moment has just created a sense of camaraderie, and a sense of, mission dominated and mission related kind of embrace by our staff that has just been absolutely phenomenal. So I feel like I'm learning from them even more so, like you mentioned, we try to be that place, but it sometimes takes a different kind of scenario or a different situation that challenges us, that shows us who we are and who we truly aspire to be. We aspire to be a community centered institution. And I think we're going to double down on that in the future.
And one of the ways that I think about that in the challenge of now is that it's the beginning of hurricane season here, right? We've dealt with that a couple of times. And when that kind of challenge happens, we pride ourselves on how art and society come together in the museum for the benefit of each other and others. Literally, we have been a point in which people can come and pick up relief supplies, this environment now, we can't do that. So we're all in this position where we- we want to be in service. And we thought about different ways to do that. And I think that's going to elevate the way that we function as museums, when we reopen.
It's wonderful to have beautiful things and collections and to bring great art into the building, but what do you do with it and how does it impact people's lives is going to be paramount.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. Karen, at the new museum co-founded NEW INC the world's first museum led incubator. I've been a longtime fan, and know that NEW INC is often cited as one of the most progressive entrepreneurial initiatives in the cultural sector anywhere around the world. And you clearly have your finger on the pulse of the startup and creative ecosystem of New York City, and have been successful in introducing some new models, things that would have been looked at as being futuristic or completely outside of what a museum is or should be, and I think that's commendable. Can you talk a little bit about NEW INC and some of the initiatives that you've worked on and the mindset that that's enabled for your museum to rapidly adapt and experiment with new ideas?
Karen Wong:
Yes, hi, thank you. I'm so happy to be a part of this panel. Exactly as you were talking about NEW INC this incubator for art, design and technology. We have so many what we're calling creative technologists, interactive designers. When COVID-19 hit so many of them were small studios, freelancers, a lot of their work was on pause or just disappeared.
And , after the first several weeks, they quickly kind of pivoted, and we changed all our professional development in our community networking to be online, to be virtual. And so all of a sudden conversations were restarting. And a couple of things happen, which is that people understand that we have to have new types of partners. So instead of the kind of lifestyle grants that many of these artists tend to work with, all of a sudden it was with community gardens, it's with Coops, it's with hospitals. And one of the terrific stories that's come out of NEW INC is we have an interactive kind of immersive designer, her background is video games. Her name is Mirelle Phillips, and she had been for over a year trying to develop immersive spaces for hospitals. She was really looking at patient care at that point. Every time it's like, "Oh, this is really a nice idea," but she was kind of always on the low end of the totem pole.
COVID-19 hits and all of a sudden the doctors she's been working with at Mount Sinai is, "We're ready to try out anything you have. Because what we really need to do is we create recovery rooms for our frontline workers. That's our doctors and our nurses." And so all of a sudden, they gave her 3,000 square feet. And she created this immersive environment that had film and video, that had audio that had healthy snacks. She tapped three other folks, in the new community who became part of her team. And they built this all within the week. It launched at the end of March. And now it's being cited as an example globally of something hospitals can do to care for their essential workers.
So what's exciting about this story for me is somebody who had an outlier idea has now become central. Working with a partner like a hospital is not usually where artists and designers think is an area of normalcy. And it's really this idea about using design and art to look at the idea of well-being around issues of safety and what safeness means in this time. So that's just one story that I want to share out.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. I mean, it's so fascinating to think that a museum can play a role in this case in cultural production, but also civic engagement and well being in a way that is not a clear connect the dots, but something that was stimulated or supported by the activities of the museum's- that's a great story.
And Lath, you're leading a museum that is focused on exploring the challenges and technologies that will be shaping the future, which leads me to believe the museum will always be looking forward as part of its mission, as part of its exhibitions as part of its content. And your museum will be, combining elements of exhibition, immersive theater and themed attractions. Can you talk through this type of approach? It's completely different and how it might inform the future of art museums and the future of the cultural sector at large?
Lath Carlson:
Absolutely. Yeah, we have a unique opportunity for the last six years we've been developing, immersive pop up museum experiences as part of the World Government Summit that's hosted in Dubai. So we have quite a bit of experience looking at the tools of futurism and applying them to full scale immersive experiences, tackling different topics such as climate crisis, such as the future of healthcare, artificial intelligence. And so we then applied that to what we're doing in the permanent museum space, the building under construction behind me. We were scheduled to open this coming September. We're now looking at alternate dates based on the current crisis. But yes, in the experiences we're creating, we are bringing together elements from many different fields.
And I think in a quite new and interesting way and our creative director Brandon McKittrick, has coined the term that we're starting to introduce expansive exhibits, as opposed to immersive experiences. Because the idea is we really are trying to create environments that not only completely immerse people in a future experience, but also give them the opportunity to expand the thinking beyond what they see is the current possibilities and the current landscape for what the future might look like. and applying a degree of true data and realistic thinking to it, but also a very optimistic point of view.
So everything we're doing is point to a optimistic future rather than a dystopian future, which, in the current crisis, I think, there's just an absolute hunger for that for people to look at this and go, how might we live actually much fuller, more creative, more dynamic lives on the other side of this as opposed to more restrictive lives. So I think that very much is going to resonate with the audience when we open.
Brendan Ciecko:
That's great. And it's interesting to hear about this concept of expansive experience versus immersive experience. And I want to expand on that note, no pun intended. But for the past decade, or even longer, many museum professionals have thrown around the term distributed museum, a museum that is no longer located in a particular physical space. The museum extends its presence through all sorts of virtual spaces on the web, as well as in transit spaces created through practices and technologies of mobility.
And we're starting to see a lot of that thinking really show its head and edit accelerated pace because of the pandemic. Do any of you see your museums or the concept of museums becoming more distributed over the next decade? And what does that idea of the distributed museum mean to you personally? We'll start with Franklin.
Franklin Sirmans:
Thanks Brendan. Just thinking about how that moves from the local to the international into the global. We've talked about it. As you mentioned, we've all talked about our expansion in terms of technology in terms of the digital. It’s becoming cliche to say pivot. But on the day that we first closed, which was March 16th, we had an all staff meeting of 100, and some odd people on Zoom. And I don't believe more than maybe five or six people had actually been on Zoom ever before that.
So, that is just one example of how we're using the technology in a different way. And we'll continue to use all of the best parts of it as we move forward, even when we are back into the museum space. And then the idea of the digital museum is something that I know for us has been embraced wholeheartedly and we've talked about it. We actually have been working very closely with the Knight Foundation, and have made good headway in the course of the last year.
But what we've been able to do in the last two months with this concentrated focus on programming and on communication with our public and just the desire, to continue to do what it is we do best, which is to provide these experiences with art and to create places to have meaningful conversations that are triggered by the art has been absolutely phenomenal to watch. And I know we're going to continue to embrace that in the future.
Brendan Ciecko:
That's great. Karen, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this because I would imagine that a curator at New Museum would probably be the first curator to actually put a VR headset on or to experience augmented reality. I think that's a completely feasible assumption to make. So you guys have this different type of lens around these types of technologies that enable distribution. So I'd love to hear what your thought of the distributed museum looks like for the New Museum but also the field at large.
Karen Wong:
Well, I think for the field at large, I just would love to tackle that first that in the last decade, I think we can all agree that when we were thinking about distributed museums, we were thinking about partnerships with folks from many other far afield cities, we were looking at all kinds of travel. We were very excited about bringing artists from different confidence to your museum. And so the idea of distribution was really around this idea of being both global and local. But in this idea of transportation to be quite frank, and certainly the IDEA CITY program was trying to find partners and like minded cities and to be able to learn from each other that could have been in Istanbul and in San Paulo or Shanghai.
I think when we now talk about a distributed museum, we are very much leaning into what Franklin is talking about. Is how our ecosystem is very different with the technology and whom we can talk to who maybe we didn't have access to pre COVID. And then with regards to artists working with technology, yes, we've always leaned into that with art intact. We have this amazing first law program, which is commission's for online art with Rhizome that's been going on for the last five, six years. I think what everyone is really having to be very sensitive about is with these new technologies, it's very easy to experience them at home, but how you experience them in public spaces, I felt just over the last two years, we were really starting to make a lot of headway with that.
There were so many festivals, leaders like Tribeca and Sundance and South by SouthWest. Many of our artists are able to participate in those types of forums with virtual reality with augmented, with extended reality. But now with the new intense safety protocols, we're going to have to rethink some of those ways of interactions. And we will probably look to do things that are more web-based and more application-based.
Brendan Ciecko:
Interesting. So it is interesting to think about the remote role or the virtual role that museums will have to play from those points that you made around safety and health and all of that. And Lath we one could argue that if you wanted to have a glimpse of a futuristic city or a futuristic society or government take a look at the United Arab Emirates and Dubai. I know when I visited a few years back I popped by Techstars Dubai, one afternoon, but was also shown the Dubai Future Foundation, as well as the world's first government accelerator, and Youth X Hub. And also heard about your minister of artificial intelligence and Minister of happiness.
So I'm curious about having exposure and learning and experiencing osmosis, what are some new aspects? Whether it be AR, whether it be VR, whether it be artificial intelligence, automation robots? What are some of the things you think we might see sooner than we thought due to COVID-19, especially as it relates to remote experience?
Lath Carlson:
Sure. First off, I'll make a point that all of my museums tend to do things backwards. So my last museum, I live in computers, we were an online museum before we were a physical museum. So we allowed online access to vintage computing systems before we opened as a physical destination. And my current museum, Museum of the Future really comes out of the work of Dubai Future Foundation.
So when I was at the back in Silicon Valley, we were trying to build this ecosystem around the museum much like what Karen is talking about. Here, we start with the ecosystem. So Dubai Future Foundation runs about 25 different initiatives. The ones that Brendan was just mentioning are some of them. So the Youth Hub, Dubai Future Accelerators, which is now going into seventh cohort in that program. Things like hosting the first Robotics global finals this last year running a joint venture, with an idea called Palmwood around design thinking, a whole bunch of different initiatives that run out of DFF. And actually a whole physical space where all of those initiatives are located, in what had been a former mall that's now been transformed into something called Area 2071, which is underneath the government office tower, which is adjacent to the museum building that we're building.
So it's quite a dynamic ecosystem. And now we've actually just released a funding initiative for funding startups as well, it's a billion dirham fund. So there's quite a bit of momentum in Dubai around this idea of innovation, ecosystems and ecosystems connected to museum entities. So once again, doing it backwards and starting with the ecosystem, starting with the idea of a distributed platform and then building out the museum as the physical embodiment of that.
I would say, though, that I'm a huge proponent of the need for museums to be physical spaces. I think the social interaction in a museum and the physicality of the experience is absolutely essential to the point where I would argue that an online museum is not a museum, it's a website, it's something else. It is not, you're losing the social aspect of the experience, you're losing the physicality of it, you're losing the experience that you don't basically plan for it. To me, it's the difference between me reading the Sunday Times online versus reading it in a physical form, right? The things you stumble upon in a physical space are just different in a physical media than online.
I think that's really important to preserve. And that's one of the things I'm concerned about as we move forward, right? With so many museums talking about taking exhibitions online and doing and it's just I think it's really going to be problematic to do that because we've established an entire practice of creating physical exhibitions. I've been doing it for almost 30 years. It's a very well established practice, and to take that and try to turn it into something completely different overnight, I think is really going to be potentially a mistake for institutions.
And I think, obviously, there's funding implications as well. We've seen that obviously in the media where when you go online and make it free, all of a sudden your funding model absolutely collapses.
And I'm just concerned, museums going down that path, and as long term sustainability of it. So I'd say the physical space is absolutely key for me, and also our museum to kind of correct some perceptions that are out there. We're actually much more about the human experience of the future and how humans will adapt and find creative solutions to the challenge we face and not about the technical side.
So previous materials about our museum have led people to assume we're about flying cars and robots. No, we're actually about human activity, human creativity, how we might meet these challenges, in particular, really understanding the social dimensions of many of the challenges that we face as they're not frankly, technical solutions that we really are eating, we actually have most of the technical solutions that we need to address things like the climate crisis, it's more of a political problem, a social problem than it is a technical problem to solve. And that's the focus we're taking in the museum.
Brendan Ciecko:
Well, that's great. And thank you for clarifying that. It's always interesting to hear even despite the ecosystem around the museum and the forward looking around even the tools and the technologies that you have access to that you are completely bullish on the idea that museums will always be physical places of the underlying importance of physicality for social interaction.
So I have a question for you, Franklin. Over the past 100 years or so, the role of museums has obviously evolved significantly from simply being stewards or protectors of objects to institutions of public education, to being community centers, town comments, places to promote well being and even innovation labs. COVID-19 has forced us to think more deeply about who our audiences and communities are, and about what our communities need from us. So in the future, how does the role that the museum plays in the community evolve, in your point of view?
Franklin Sirmans:
I think one of the things that's interesting, I also love our objects and the idea of being around them physically, not only appreciating but having an experience with our objects. But the thing that I think about in the context of digital is that we do a program called Local Views. And so it's artists do as a studio here in Miami, and kind of takes you through parts of the museum that they find interesting.
And we do that in the physical space of the building on Thursday night around six o'clock and you get a dozen, maybe 20 something people and it's a very intimate important experience. But what I've witnessed in the last couple of months where you have people plugging in from all over the world who are interested in the point of view of this artist who lives here in this moment and their relationship to this local sphere, it has been phenomenal. And so now you have hundreds of people looking at what is ostensibly a local view. And I think it's instructive for how we move forward with the idea of being community centered and how we define being community centered, right?
Because I think what we're discovering is that our community, we knew they were out there, or at least we knew the members who have been in and then go back to somewhere else. But we're finding that we have a community that is strong, resilient, and interested in the things we're doing in a much broader sense of the word than we often use it in our museum context.
So it's an international community that is interested and sort of shared cultural goals, shared interests in identity, shared interest in geography, that has, frankly, come to the fore in a way that we might not have ever seen. So I'm hopeful about that aspect.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you.
Franklin Sirmans:
Did I answer your question?
Brendan Ciecko:
Yeah. And Karen, on the topic of community, I know you have a background that really looks at civic engagement and social impact. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the New Museum's role there, as well as where you think the museum might be moving towards.
Karen Wong:
I think one of the mistakes that museums can make is trying to be all things to all people. You have to lean into what you're good at, what your mission statement is. And so I think that's how come things like IDEA CITY and NEW INC were born out of what is really the type of civic engagement that makes sense for, our museum, and it was certainly with contemporary artists leaning into the idea of expanding the notion of the word artists in this time. And so those are definitely the types of communities and networks we've built.
I think like every museum as well right now. And it's really exciting to see our education departments really take leads in terms of content design. I think there's this moment right now, because people are slowing down, and that they have time to spend either being educated or- or doing these deeper dives. It's very exciting where I feel, new museums, education programming over the summer is really going to be highlighted because there's demand, interests and as well as all of the young people who are not in school, we're developing, curriculum specific, to this moment. So that students can remain engaged with contemporary art.
So I wanted to just comment on length. I really like this word that you use for expansive rather than immersive. I'm going to steal that. I really think it's something that we can all put our thinking caps on in terms of what that means. And it really goes towards this conversation, Brendan that you're leading.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. And off of that the idea of the needs of the community, the shifting audience, and even the doubling down on content creation and putting all of these educational materials out there. I'm very curious, Lath, in your situation where Dubai is an international city. It was designed to be international, to be transient, people coming from all over the world with a big emphasis on tourism. So when your audience has shifted in that tourism is going to be impacted for the months and maybe years to come. How does that change your perspective on your reach from a content perspective. I'm very curious about that.
Lath Carlson:
That's a really good question. As a museum that's not yet open, we have had this opportunity to really dig into this deeply and also to be a museum connected to a whole community of futurists. With all the projections and reports and things that people think about where does this go? Truly daily I've got multiple ones, and some are quite depressing, some were quite uplifting, in where we might be. For us, we are absolutely an international destination, we're the busiest international destinations in the world, fourth most visited city in the world.
And that is a key aspect of Dubai and incredibly diverse community. So we always knew that was an aspect of the museum and we're working with partners truly globally to build the museum so that as well, we have adjusted our assumptions. I mean, we are anticipating international travel is going to take some time to recover, although frankly, there's some very encouraging studies coming out of China in particular already. And also even from India, I just got a report yesterday from India of what the anticipation there is. And that's where a large number of our visitors from China and India are large source countries for us as well as a number of African nations and other GCC countries.
I would say we are looking at much heavier GCC visitation rather than so much international as people in the Gulf, states who might normally travel to Europe or to America are now looking at traveling more in the region. And I think it's really interesting to note the countries frankly that have had a really positive good response to this crisis. UAE actually being one of them. And obviously, South Korea, Singapore, New Zealand, I think all those countries will be rewarded in travel in the coming years, whereas countries like the US that have completely botched the response are really going to pay a long term price for that with international travel and visitation.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. And looking at it, Franklin, it sounds like this has been a moment of camaraderie, a unity amongst your staff and also learning about each other and learning about the great capabilities and the dedication of your team. I'm curious, 10 years out or even 20 years out, what tools or skill sets do you see as being vital to the future of museums? So the future success of museums, so the future success of them in their communities?
Franklin Sirmans:
Well, it's kind of an interesting two part question. I'll start at the beginning and think about what I've seen from the staff and from coming together is this sort of not renewed, because it's always there. But this sense of mission that I think underlies certainly our three institutions, that museums can play a role in society that no other institution can play, right? We can look at things politically, socially, economically, we can be spurred on by great art that helps us see things with a renewed sense of possibility or a sense of optimism. And God, do we need that right now.
If we speak about our country, and we look at the disparity of how COVID-19 has affected just every one of our communities, something's not right. And I believe that within our relationship to "community" whether that is your immediate vicinity or the extended international community online, that we have a duty to each other to be questioning of our world in a way that allows for, in a cliche, a greater level of humanity.
And I think we believe that art objects, the study of art objects, it has that promise, and then when you put the community centered approach on top of that, it can lead to something better in this regard. And I think that we have to embrace that in the future and we have to. That has to be incorporated into our mission is how we function. When we say a museum, I think people have a certain level of respect for honesty, intellectual integrity, an appreciation of a diversity of intellectual thought, and certainly diversity of identities that we really have to double down on. And I think that's what we're going to try and embrace in the future.
I just want to add one thing to that because if we talk about relaunching, and we talk about reopening, and we talked about looking different in the future first and foremost safety and health is something that we also have to promote as part of our social contract as museums.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. And we've been exploring over the past several months that Coronavirus has truly accelerated the digital transformation of museums. Many have been ramping up, obviously, as we've talked about today, as we've seen in the news, as we've seen in our own organizations, digital content efforts to keep audiences connected and engaged throughout the closures and even into the reopening.
So thinking specifically about safety and health and well being and also the limits on tourism and reduced capacity, and tactile experiences, what are your thoughts on what the actual in person experience looks like as we come back? Does that change the way it looks into the future? Is it just a temporary moment around rethinking the visitor experience to fill the gap of right now to maybe minimize physical touch points and social interactions, which we all know are of critical importance? I'd love to hear, Karen, your thoughts on this.
Karen Wong:
What's been quite amazing that's been happening in New York is that there are so many different kinds of volunteer task force. There's the ones that are within your own Museum, then there's the one within the cities, museums, and then even more broader nationally. And everyone is sharing information being so collegial and thinking through how do we do this together? I think it's very critical that you experience something similar from museum to museum. So that way, the idea of safety hopefully is both a local and national definition that we can all embrace with the same type of protocols.
I think for our museum, in person experiences will change forever. And one of the things we're tackling with here in New York City specifically is that we're actually trying not to be grouped with the performing arts to be quite frank, because it's a very different experience and we're trying to advocate with both mayor and the governor, that there is a type of agency you have agency over your own body in a museum where you can leave at any moment, you can walk away, you can social distance appropriately. But again, I think the idea of the protocols, the new type of equipment about museums will have to invest in, it's a lot to wrap our heads around, it's going to be costly to be able to bring back the public in a way that I know we all want to, which is at the highest level of feeling secure.
I think we'll start off like most people are saying, at a time ticketing and making sure that there's only a certain number of people in your museum, reduced hours. So it's a new dawn for all of us. I think I'm very inspired by how well we're working with, each other across, the museum community. And so I think we'll get there, faster than most people are predicting.
Brendan Ciecko:
That's great to hear. And it's also interesting to hear your thoughts on the fact that people have a certain expectation that should be kind of shared as a standard from museum to museum. Just even in terms of the place feeling, and having the assurances that it's of a certain quality of a certain standard of safety across the city of New York, across the country as well, and maybe across the globe. So I'm fascinated by that notion. And there's so much material out there, right now recommendations, best practices, strategies, tips, and also there are places that are already open, that are happy and eager to share. So I imagine a lot of facilities managers and deputy directors and COOs are getting emails left and right from other organizations that want to know how you did this. And how's that going so far.
So kind of shifting gears just a little bit. I read a piece in Harvard Business Review a couple years ago that made the claim that innovation is as much about finding partners, as it is building products, really underscoring the importance of partnership and collaboration. And so whether this be with other museums or agencies or your cities, corporations or foundations. I know Franklin, you spoke about the Knight Foundation's role that they're playing in Karen, I know the Knight Foundation has been greatly supportive of the New Museum and NEW INC. Can everyone talk a little bit about the role that they see partnerships playing in the future of museums?
Lath Carlson:
I'd say to my earlier point, I mean, we grew out of that model since we grew out of Dubai Future Foundation, which is all around partnerships of various kinds. Also, we work very closely with the government ministries within Dubai. So actually, my board of directors is made up mostly of ministers, including Minister of artificial intelligence, Minister of happiness, Minister of climate change in the environment, Minister food security.
So , working very closely with that whole constellation of partners. But also, we're developing these incredible expansive, exhibiting environments, with partners globally. So we're working with artists and designers and technologists truly around the planet everywhere from China, to Russia, to, Serbia to UK to the US. So all over and I think that that global network is really important and getting those perspectives, from the rest of the world. And also, frankly, into the earlier point, I think Karen was making many of those artists and studios absolutely need a project like ours right now. And they've seen so many projects evaporate overnight. So to have the work that we're providing is keeping actually a lot of these studios, frankly, going right now. and so it's I think that's an important role, also to understand for museums is that we are economic engines, we do support an entire community of not only the staff and contractors, but just a massive constellation of economic work that comes out of museums and is created by museums.
I know in the US AAM has tried very hard to get that point across in the political realm, to get people to understand how much economic might actually museums do wield. And I know somebody's been saying a lot. They're more museum staff in the US than coal miners, for instance, right? And so why aren't we part of the political agenda in the same way?
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. And Franklin, what are your thoughts on partnership?
Franklin Sirmans:
Keeping in mind the sort of idea of governmental partnership, I think in this country, something needs to change. I don't know if we're going to look at models that are more akin to Europe or more akin to the Middle East, but we've got to find a better way to work between government and foundations and individuals, as far as the way that museums go about being in business. And I think that there is somebody said in the chat, we need to administer empathy or minister of happiness. I couldn't agree more. But I think that is kind of our job and part of the ecology of our nation and of our civic responsibility is often to be that voice and to have a seat at the table with government entities with the foundations, which we have. We mentioned Knight, Mellon, Ford, we could go on and on. There is an incredible history of foundation support for our institutions that needs to be combined with a perhaps, I think, a greater level of governmental support in this conversation. We love objects, and we love looking at art, but we're not showing images. We're not talking about in that sense.
We're talking about providing something that we believe is vital for everyone and certainly the government should be a part of that conversation, perhaps in a more supportive way than it has been in the past, at least in this country.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. And Karen, I want to start with you-do you ever look to other industries for inspiration, ideas, or even challenge the traditional way of doing things as someone in a museum or any of you looking to other leaders, other industries, as you think about what the future of the sector looks like? Are there, specific to the pandemic, are there any organizations? Are there any sectors? Are there any companies that you're looking to as you plan your reopening? Now also, what the next couple of years may look like.
Karen Wong:
I'll just throw out a couple of inspirations particularly around the idea of digital content creation. I want to shout out a couple of museum examples first, because you don't have to reinvent the wheel and there have been a lot of pioneers who have been doing great work for decades. And I want to shout out the Walker Art Museum, in terms of how they've built their online community. Their website even 15 years ago was just really ahead of everyone.
When you go to museum websites, the first thing is always around exhibitions. We've looked at this idea of our website as a brochure for our physical space, quite frankly. And the Walker , as I said, a decade ago, really leaned into, being more of a magazine slash media platform, and it remains gorgeous. And then another shout out to MOCA LA for doing MOCATV. Everyone thought it was a weird, stupid idea. And it didn't unfortunately last long because they couldn't build an audience. Maybe it was just before its time. But this idea of museums, having TV channels or being a channel, I think is an exciting idea.
And then of course I'm right now very obsessed with Swizz Beatz and Timbaland's Verzuz platform on Instagram Live. They call it in their sound bites. Make sure I want to get this out, correct. Celebrating the architects of good music. And what I love about it is they've been really focused on songwriters and producers, people who have been behind the scenes. And again, people who've been in the industry for a long time, kind of almost like your senior gurus, who maybe have been sidelined during this kind of Gen Z millennial TikTok moment. So it's really exciting what they're doing. And I think that museums can learn two things, which is around the idea of this behind the scenes, which we all love and try to do, but do it at a really high level.
And again, surfacing up, "marginalized voices" because I do think there's a moment right now, where we have the time to take that in.
Brendan Ciecko:
That's great. Thank you. And I think I have a couple like knee jerk ways. So that is often the things that are seemingly big, dumb, stupid ideas are some of the most basic pioneering and transformative creations whether it be by a museum, whether it be by an artist, whether it be by a technologist. I imagine at some point in time, the platform that we're using for this webinar Zoom was a dumb idea. And the museums that were founded were an idea to overlook. I can't stress that enough. And I'm glad to hear you point that out about MOCATV and the great work that they're doing in LA.
But the second point is just I think this was the first Swizz Beatz shout out on our webinar. So I have a lot of great admiration for that Karen. And Swizz Beatz aside from what he's doing in his music careers, absolutely leaving his mark and leaving his print on the art world, especially with emerging African American visual artists. And he's kind of a fixture down in Miami during Art Basel. Incredible to see what someone who's not a museum person, not historically an artwork person is able to kind of disrupt and shake things up in a way that grabs our attention.
Franklin Sirmans:
That goes back perfectly to what you were saying about collaboration. To look at support across sectors, as you just pointed out. I have to say it in this context, on June 16, I'm doing a conversation with DJ Stretch Armstrong also has a relationship to music and art and community on both sides. So we're trying to collaborate and expand on that conversation. Karen, such a perfect example. If ever we've seen an example of artists pointing us in the right direction and showing us the way, what those guys have done with DJ Nice has done with quarantine it's been absolutely phenomenal to watch.
Karen Wong:
Yeah.
Brendan Ciecko:
On that, Franklin, even on that point about the role that the artist is playing and pointing us in the right direction. I know that last week or the week before the week before that time is confusing these days but I know that you were in live conversation with Jerry Saltz, who is probably one of the most highly visible art critics and thinkers on the role of artists. What were some of the flavor conversations like if you could soundbite that or summarize some of those?
Franklin Sirmans:
Well as somebody who comes out of a writing and art criticism background for me growing up and listening and reading him, and the way that he speaks to everyone is the key. So the kind of things he would say are squarely aimed at a popular version of talking about art and having it be a part of everyone's life from the silly in some ways, Bravo TV shows on how to make art. So you're talking about the most old art historical arguments around the breadth of the conversation is phenomenal, right? For a self proclaimed truck driver who knew nothing about art and, of course, came to it from being an artist.
Brendan Ciecko: Yeah, thank you. While COVID-19 has presented enormous challenges to all of us, it's already begun to inspire and push a lot of new ways of thinking. Both institutionally, culturally also, as we're just talking about from the artists side. So jump starting all types of new things, digital transformation, just being one of them. We've seen museum professionals start to adopt an attitude of, experimentation, a spirit of experimentation.
So thinking about some of these mindsets, and how that might create a slightly different or completely different type of museum experience of the future, museum flavor of the future, museum brand of the future. I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts on that mindset, 'cause your people, they've been doing great work, but there's something different. There's a certain sense of being. There's a certain sense of empowerment that we're in this together, we're fighting the hard fight, and being agile and experimental is a big part of that.
Lath, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this as someone where your museum is in the process of opening and you're surrounded by an innovative ecosystem and government and community. And then I'd love to hear Karen's thoughts. And then Franklin's thoughts.
Lath Carlson:
Sure, like so many other things in the realm of futurists work and thinking, trends that we're already moving forward have just been radically accelerated by this, right? And we're seeing that, particularly in retail and eCommerce and in other areas. We were very fortunate, I would say that we may have anticipated a bit of this. So we are, we've always planned on being a time ticketed experience, for instance, and we were concerned about needing to educate the public on that. Now as everyone is moving towards that, that just helps us immensely kind of in not needing to do maybe so much of that education.
So I think there's trends like that we're looking at, but this is just accelerating. Also, as someone who spent most of my career building traditionally interactive experiences and museums, I think we're due for disrupting that and getting past that and I think there's a lot of good research that shows those experiences are not actually as good as we maybe have deluded ourselves into thinking.
And in my experience in most interactive experiences, the audience struggles most of the time to figure out how to use the thing. And once they figured out how to use it, they move on and they've actually lost any of the learning outcomes that we might have wanted to embed in the experience. So I think there's a real miss there and rushed to kind of make everything interactive, I think we've actually lost a lot of the richness that comes from more theatrical experiences, more contemplative experiences, more social experiences in museums.
So that's where we're headed with our institution. So we're actually doing very little traditionally interactive, in a museum which frankly, right now we feel a little smug and okay. We don't have to really worry about the like because we already we're not really focused on the touch so much in the museum but much more on the theatrical nature, the social nature, the expansiveness of the experiences we're providing.
That said, we are making some operational adjustments. It’s hard to say, we may be opening at a point where there is a globally available vaccine. And that would change things immensely. Right? So we're, we're nimble right now in where we are. And I think we can be very lucky. We're in a phase of the project that we can pivot around a little bit more easily than most institutions.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. I'm just realizing we only have four or five minutes left. So I just want to say a couple things. And then we'll end with our big last question. After this webinar, we're going to compile everyone's questions and ideas and solutions that have been taking place in the Q&A. And in the chat, we're going to combine them into one unified document and share them with the community to interact and to get advice and recommendations and to see what other people are thinking about.
So feel free to share some of your closing thoughts in the webinar chat or send them over email or Twitter. We hope that everyone is having the smoothest possible ride towards reopening whatever that does look like at your institution. And we're all striving to be as ready as we can be for this to be successful. And the mere fact that you're here today, tuning in from wherever you're tuning in somewhere around the world shows that you're taking proactive steps in preparing your museum. The strength of the cultural community is the community that we build together. And I've seen such an incredible togetherness and unity amongst the museum field.
So only have a couple more minutes. So we're going to end on closing words from all of our amazing guest speakers. Franklin, can you leave us with one big idea that we can bring back to our organizations during this time? Whether it relates to what we're doing now or what we're doing as we move towards the future?
Franklin Sirmans:
I think one thing that we're talking about right now is and it's dependent upon the context of places outdoors or indoors is the face that we're in right now. And maybe that looks like socially distant educational programming outside to the more traditional sculpture garden kind of aspect of what we do. I think that's something that we'll be transitioning into wholeheartedly. And I'm just admired by our peers who have figured out ways to be front line or at least frontline aligned with our first responders in confronting this crisis. Because we're all speaking from this vantage point that in our new normal has become that even in this little period of time, and it's an immense thing that we're all dealing with across the world, together.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Lath, how about you? What's one big, small or medium sized idea we can bring back to our institutions right now?
Lath Carlson:
I would say never underestimate, the creative potential of people working together to accomplish something and I think we've seen that In so many communities in this crisis, is that people truly coming together and working together to come up with innovative solutions to their center to move it forward, whether it be communities in schools and teachers and first responders and people working to increase food security and help people in need. I mean, it's just been incredible to see that. And that's what gives me hope for the future.
Brendan Ciecko:
Thank you. Karen, what's one idea we can bring back to our institutions right now?
Karen Wong:
Figure out how you can jumpstart the creative economy. And the reason why I'm talking about the economy is that post COVID we will remain in trouble. And so how can we work with partners to really make sure their sustainability and resilience and the practices of artists and designers, writers, actors, so that would be my plea.
Brendan Ciecko:
I've been so inspired by the work that all three of you are doing and the work of your institution. So I just want to say how grateful I am and how grateful the community is that you have all put aside a little bit of time to share some of your thoughts, your perspectives, your hopes. I thank all of you, I hope that you're staying safe and happy and healthy and hope we'll be able to cross paths sometime in the near future. So, thank you so much.
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